Hohner Crossover's My Favorite Harp Now
I usually play special 20s, but I often have to toss them. I got a set semi-customized and many are much better. I got one fully customized. But the best of all is the Crossover. Easy to bend, and none of the holes are thin or airy. I'm expecting a couple more customized. I'll see how they compare. The Crossover's an A. I want to play everything in E now. Check 'em out.
Responding to myself, I just noticed Kinya's post here:
http://www.bluesharmonica.com/marine_band_crossover_and_suzuki_manji_que...
"Although the tuning varies, the Marine Band Crossover reeds are identical to the Marine Band 1876, Marine Band Deluxe, Marine Band Special 20 and Golden Melody."
So why do folks rave about the crossover so much compared to the other hohner harps with the same reeds (MB 1896, MB, MB deluxe, S20, GM)? I'm pretty happy with S20s most of the time but I like the brighter sound of the deluxe / crossover. However there's not a huge quality difference to me, just a tonal preference.
I haven't bought enough deluxes or crossovers to get a good sense of the quality control, but so far they've all been good - except one that had two misaligned and squealing reeds. It was easy to fix, but that made me think that maybe it's just the luck of the draw no matter what model you buy.
Steve
I think that special 20 is the easiest harmonica to play but when you have it in your hands you can feel it is a low profile quality product, and the sound is a little bit dull for my taste, even opening the plates in the back.
My favourite harmonica would be a calmed down Manji, I think that suzuki's engineers surely have tried to copy marine band brightness but they have failed controlling those crazy reeds.
If we are not speaking about money suzuki's fire breath is a great great harmonica, it has a lovely sound.
I am a Marine Band lover, for me it has the best sound but I feel Hohner's harmonica always need a lot of work, they're out of tune each three days and I don't want to spend so much time dealing with files, scrapers and screws. Sure I will try a Seydel one (steel reeds) one of these days.
Anyway I have bought composite woods for more marine bands, just for fun, I am addicted to those 1896 plates.
Seydel 1847 Classic (-:
Responding to Sergio:
I think that special 20 is the easiest harmonica to play but when you have it in your hands you can feel it is a low profile quality product, and the sound is a little bit dull for my taste, even opening the plates in the back.
Why do you feel the S20 is a low quality product? In my experience the quality is about the same between the S20, deluxe and crossover. I agree about the dull sound however, but as you said that's a matter of taste not quality.
I wish Hohner made a MB with a plastic comb, keeping everything else exactly the same, including the price!
Steve
Jon, I noticed that the Seydel Classics have rounded holes. Do you find these to be an issue? Also are the holes further apart than HB's? I've been playing Lee Oskars but I'm looking to upgrade eventually. I would go with MB's but I don't like the sharp corners. Even though I know I can file them off, I'd rather have a harp with smooth corners to begin with.
-Taylor
I'm not sure about the size comparison to a Lee Oskar however as I remember a LO is larger than a MB. I really like the rounded holes and got used to them very quickly. If you are worried about that you could try an 1847 Silver which has straight holes and a plastic comb. They're very nice too.
Just checked out the 1847 Classic at Guitar Center I like it a lot. The holes aren't too round. I think I'll order one off amazon (a lot cheaper) and try it out.
Thank you,
Taylor
Speaking about top harmonicas.
If you can you have to try Suzuki's Fire Breath, what a piece of equipment!
I have just received (well, two hours ago) two crossovers (Bb and C) and they are just what I expected, a bolted marine band.
Ootb they are not near as good as my manji, is by far less responsive, but I have to say that the two are gapped too wide. I can see in every one of them two points of leakage between the comb and the plates.
For me this model only represents a time saver, no drilling holes, no looking for special bolts,... I can change the comb for a predrilled one, it is only about comfort.
The crossover tuning is not as bad as I expected, it sounds good but I prefer the marine band traditional just intonation tuning.
By the way I like very much the comb.
I am sure that after some tweaking it will be a very good harmonica, but not ootb.
I've worked with at least two dozen Crossovers and Marine Bands in the last year...the Crossovers have all been more responsive, louder, and more present in tone. That being said, the combs have been lacquered differently and it is possible that some of the older Crossovers don't have as tight of tolerances. I've never noticed any leaky combs/plates other than maybe 1 draw. I've found in every instance if I left the comb alone and just flat sanded the draw plate, it was enough to make it air tight.
I know for a fact that they are gapped to tighter tolerances. That being said, they don't all OB well out of the box and almost none have been good overdraw harps without further modification.
I like the tuning as I find the traditional 7 Limit Just to be WAY out of tune with a band. 19 Limit is great if you play blues and stick to 1st, 2nd, and 3rd positions.
Thanks for the info Mike, here and other posts... interesting observations.
Thanks!
The Cross Harp is being discontinued and I can't find them does anyone know where I can order them from?
I just bought 4 Crossovers (G, A, C, D) and a Thunderbird (LF).
These are great!
I needed to re-gap the 2 and 3 blow reeds on the A harp; once i did that it became the sweetest A i have ever played. My MBD in A is a nice harp, but this is better. more responsive and more even response across the harp.
when i took it apart i noticed one of the 3 plate screws was very tight. i also noticed visible gaps between comb and draw plate. when i took it apart there did seem to be some ever-so-tiny specks of dried lacquer on the comb, i just brushed it with my fingers and it seemed to go back together better.
when i put it back together the 2 draw bend worked well but 2 blow was buzzing. it wasn't like that before. i took it apart and looked for problems, put it back together and tried it, just holding the covers in place. worked fine. bolted it back together, 2 blow buzzed. noticed it worked perfectly until i tightened the rear screw at low end. did it up just snug, no problem. can only guess there is a slight warp in the comb? really dont know what this could be but seems the reed plate must be moving when i tighten that screw. it works if i do it up just tight enough to not be loose.
the rest of the crossovers are all great OOTB. i managed a 6OB on the C harp as i walked home from the bus. 1st OB ever! i don't even really care about overblows atm, it was just curiosity. maybe now i'm more curious...it would be good...
it has taken me a long time to commit to a single type. i dithered over the crossovers because they are quite expensive, but i am glad i took the plunge.
Now saving for the Bb, Eb and standard F...
I've worked on a few Crossovers lately and mounted them to Richard Sleigh's Corian Comb. I like them without the comb and OOTB. but modified and with the airtight Corian Comb they make a really great harp. I'm planning on doing the same thing to a MB Deluxe. The covers and reed plates are the same and mounted on Corian Combs they'll virtually be the same harp except the tuning will be different. I happen to like the MB Deluxe tuning. Let's face it I'm just crazy about any quality harmonica and think Seydel, Suzuki, and Hohner make excellent models in their respective product line. The thing to look for when selecting a harmonica is airtightness, ease of bending, and sound. I prefer the traditional blues sound (even harps tuned to just intonation). As for ease of bending I believe any harp player should learn how to gap and tune they're harmonicas. I know some pros will always send their harps to the customizers but today the average player should be able to maintain they're own harps... especially with the price of harps. I'm sure Kinya will cover the basic setup when he produces MB 101.
Jon Harl
5731 Meridian Ave.
San Jose, CA 95118
Cell: 408/531.5755
www.customseydels.com
I own both and like them a lot.the deluxe plays great and has that smooth classic sound while the manji is a bit brighter and raspier.
I like Seydel 1847 Classic and Silver.
And Suzuki Promaster and Manji are also nice.
I started with special 20's, moved to marine band crossovers, then the seydel 1847. One thing that really surprised me was the Seydel was significantly easier to bend. It's a darker tone than the crossover. I can hit 4,5,6 overblows just as easily with either harp, but the blow bending and regular draw bending is much easier to get accurate bends on with the seydel. Granted, I am pretty new to playing. working on buying a whole set of seydels, but that gets pricey when you get every key.
i was dithering back and forth over my next harmonica purchase. Mostly I play Special 20's with a few 1896, MB deluxe, and a crossover in F. I will have to agree the crossover is excellent but my friend gifted me a Rocket in B a few months ago. Being it is in B, I rarely get the chance to play it. I do have one D harp which is a Lee Oskar and so as a comparison I will never own another LO.
So there is my decision and the D harp is being replaced with a Hohner Rocket in D which is on order.
It is so very interesting how everybody has unique experiences with each model. As our abilities improve, so does our understanding of the harmonicas improve and thus the quality (or set up) of the harps must improve.
John
I saw on one of Honer's videos that they say the combs on the rockets are larger at the hole and narrow toward the back. Has anyone seen this on their's? I've got 1 rocket in the key of C, I wasn't a big fan of the bigger holes at first, but if there is a reason that makes sense, like more responsiveness I can live with that. I've been a s 20 player since the 70's, but bought 3 last month and 2 were good ootb, but the A key, needs work on holes 2&3. I'm trying to justify the $70.00 for the rocket if I won't need to repair them ootb. I'd like to hear from other Rocket players.
i can't guarantee you won't need to tweak a rocket. I dont think there is any factory model harp which you could guarantee won't need a tweak. Maybe if you got an 'artist setup' from Hohner you could be confident.
but apart from that, I have seen a few Rockets here for repair. Usual stuff, blown 5 draw reeds. One was odd, both pairs of reeds in chambers 6 and 7 were bent at 45 degrees. I reckon the owner tried to ha them while he was drunk, or his mates decided to shut him up.
all the rockets I've seen impressed me as very good harps. I like sp20s, and the rockets just seem a little bit more refined. A better sp20.
But again, they use the same reed plates as sp20 and will have the same variation which is just a fact of mass production of a hand made product. Some reeds will be off centre, some will be gapped higher or lower, some will enter the slot nose first...some will be tuned better than others, some tuning will be heavy-handed and leave the reed with burrs or weak spots...the same is true for all factory made harps
Have you tried the MB Deluxe? Right this instant that's my favorite harp but I go between that, special 20s and the crossover. I think the deluxe and the crossover are essentially the same harp except for the comb and the tuning.
The crossover has a laminated bamboo comb that should be totally resistant to swelling, whereas the deluxe wood comb is only partially sealed. In practice however I haven't had problems with swelling with either model.
The tuning of the deluxe is the same as the special 20 and standard MB - a compromise tuning that is closer to just intonation. The crossover tuning is also a compromise, but closer to equal temperament. I prefer the deluxe tuning because the chords sound better. Beyond that I can't tell much difference between the crossover and the deluxe. Both are brighter than the s20. I think that's due to the open cover plates, and because the s20 has a recessed comb perhaps. But maybe it really is the comb material. I doubt it but who knows.
I'm not sure but I think the reeds are the same on all three models. I think the plates are the same too, except that the s20 has more screw holes and in different positions. I'm not sure about that however. People rave about how great the crossover is compared to the s20 though. Perhaps the quality control on the reed gapping and tuning is better?
Steve